On Thursday December 4, 2008 the Department of Community Affairs Secretary Thomas Pelham approved the development order and agreement for the controversial CSX Integrated Logistics Center – a 318 acre state-of-the art facility designed to facilitate transfer of containerized consumer goods via rail and truck. Barring any further appeal, it looks like construction will begin sometime in 2009.
If this project sounds big, it is. In fact, some State officials are calling it “The Mother of All Rail Yards.”
The city of Winter Haven signed a deal in September 2007 with the company and sold CSX the land for $22,000 per acre. CSX also has the option to purchase 930 acres adjacent to its currently planned site.
Questions about the $22,000 per acre price have arisen regarding whether that price point is reflective of today’s per acre pricing in our area or was instead set at prices as they stood back in 2006. In a November 14, 2008 article, over at LakelandLocal.com puts it this way:
No one seems to know exactly how much the state is paying CSX and for what in the rail realignment deal. It all depends on how you define it. But figures I’ve heard range from $491 million to almost $700 million. All of those numbers are bound up in one way or another with the value of the 61 miles of land and track the state plans to buy from CSX. That value was tabulated in 2005 or 2006 as the secret negotiations unfolded.
So let me ask you: Is your house worth as much now as it was in late 2005?
Other questions have come up concerning the number of jobs CSX will be bringing to the Winter Haven, Florida area. CSX estimates the total to be roughly 8,500 jobs, with 2,000 or so jobs located at the warehouse facility itself and the remaining 6,500 coming from related service industry positions. CSX maintains other such facilities and has a good idea of what it takes for a city to support them, but some local residents consider this remaining total to be too fuzzy.
Billy Townsend also wrote about this issue in a May 2007 Tampa Bay Online post:
If you’re counting, that brings us to 2,000 mostly warehouse jobs. That would make the CSX center a top-15 Polk employer, but not the giant suggested by 8,500 jobs.
So where are the other 6,500 jobs?
They are far more theoretical. CSX labels them as “employment outside the park.†They are either employees of suppliers for companies located in the park, or “employees whose work depends on income generated directly or indirectly at the park.†CSX uses restaurant and convenience store workers as examples of that second group.
Lastly, increased truck traffic through Polk County and the lack of projected train traffic volume are raising some hackles. Townsend continues:
Our next number is 1,150. That’s the number of daily truck trips onto State Road 60 that CSX expects the first phase of the project to create. Winter Haven city planners say that should not affect the level of service on State Road 60.
They were not required to – and didn’t – project impact on U.S. 27 or U.S. 98 (Bartow Road). Those two highways are virtually the only logical way for a truck to get from S.R. 60 to the Polk Parkway or Interstate 4. Several stretches of U.S. 98 are considered failing today.
As you might imagine, local area merchants and concerned citizens are concerned about traffic and associated noise issues. Interestingly, the Lakeland Ledger released a blurb today stating that Jack M. Berry Inc., one of our area’s largest subdivision developers, has proposed a 650-unit apartment complex at Eloise Loop and Pollard Road, just up the street from the planned CSX freight terminal.
I lived in Arlington Heights, IL – just outside of Chicago – for a couple of years – and we heard plenty of jet traffic from O’Hare International Airport flying overhead. I’m not saying that noise from the CSX facility will be anything like close to that. I’m just saying that there will most definitely be some level of noise to contend with.
As a Winter Haven resident, I’m excited about the prosperity coming our wayof the fact that as a result of the CSX Integrated Logistics Center. However, I do understand the frustrations some people have regarding this project, and I am mindful of the fact that there will undoubtedly be some growing pains involved with this project.
Invitation to Comment!
This one goes out to Chuck Welch, Billy Townsend, and any other local residents who would like to chime in on what’s going on with the CSX project. Chuck and Billy, you’ve done much of the legwork on this one. I’m just sort of following up! I’ve undoubtedly missed some points here… so please feel free to set me straight!
I hope you found this post useful! As always, if you or anyone you know is in need of a local Florida mortgage broker, I’m your guy. Call me at 863-604-3019 or apply online for your Florida mortgage. We’ll keep you posted and let you know when it’s time to pull the trigger!
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Good job, Kevin.
One of my problems with this project — in addition to all the secrecy of course — is the inflated job number. On June 19, 2007 I attended a meeting with CSX officials and we had quite a discussion about the expected jobs. Here’s a part of what I wrote then:
“• Jobs. Jobs. Jobs. Forget the 8500 number. Pretend you never heard it, because that depends on the hub attracting many businesses, and the number isn’t for employees in Winter Haven. Try these numbers:
• Somewhere below 200. They expect the terminal to need 200 employees, but will offer present Taft Yard employees the opportunity to transfer. So, less than 200 new jobs for Winter Haven.
• 1370 temporary construction jobs for whoever builds the thing. However, most construction companies are going to bring in their own people.
• 1800 jobs for the ILC:”
Note “CSX will own the terminal, but will not develop the rest of the facilities. They’ll find someone to do that for them.” That’s the 1800. 1100 of those jobs are estimated to average $36,800 for employee compensation. That includes salary, health insurance, retirement payments, and non-cash compensation. In other words, don’t think that is near the salary. I wonder if the salary will be a “living wage?”
And don’t forget even CSX estimates give the employee numbers as after 10 years. If they materialize.
I also would remind your readers of this: “A long discussion followed where the CSX officials were asked why they had measured “growth potential, but not impact potential.†The concern was raised that CSX was offering plenty of possible job numbers based on optimistic growth, but could not supply the same numbers for impact items (trucks traveling to and from the facility for example).”
Chuck Welch’s last blog post..Okay, Part 2 Will Wait Till Monday – LakelandLocal.com
>>The concern was raised that CSX was offering plenty of possible job numbers based on optimistic growth, but could not supply the same numbers for impact items (trucks traveling to and from the facility for example).â€<<
Chuck – thanks so much for your comments. I, too find their silence on the impact issue troubling. I wonder if they’ll foot the bill for any new road construction that becomes necessary due to increased truck traffic? Hmmm… me thinks…. um… no.
Kevin:
First, thanks for taking the time to read and think about this. It’s hugely complicated, and it feels really good to have somebody really think and consider what Chuck and I have written.
I don’t have a huge amount to add to Chuck’s comment, given the constraints of a comment thread. I’m going to do a post tomorrow on LL that you are welcome to cross post if Chuck doesn’t mind.
A couple of quick points:
1) I think the permanent job number for the hub is down to about 70 now, (I know it’s under 100) with some portion of those jobs relocated from rail yards in Orlando and Tampa.
2) There is no second phase of the project, no high end biz park. There are no 1,800 jobs. There might be one day, but there’s no proposal of any kind now. Just trains for the hub.
3) The hub is one part of the larger CSX deal with the state. The other part is the relocation of existing freight traffic out of Orlando and onto a west Florida line that runs though Ocala, Plant City and Lakeland. The state would pay to upgrade this west Florida line so that CSX can run more trains on it. This deal is far worse than the hub by itself. It’s this deal that was defeated last session, at least temporarily. This deal has the state paying upwards of a billion dollars, through various elements of the plan, to help CSX establish its business plan in the Florida. The hub is key to that business plan, but it’s not everything.
4) With regard to #2, much has changed since this deal was first announced. The most prominent thing is the economy. Supporters of this sold the benefits of this whole package based on 2004-2005 growth rates of vehicle sales and consumer product container traffic and Florida population. I saw the graphs and powerpoints. All of those things have cratered, and gas is plummeting. Who knows if this is a temporary thing, or if Florida really is “over” as the Wall Street Journal reported a while back? But it does seem to me that all of the economic assumptions underpinning this deal – and that goes for skeptics and impact-worriers like me, as well – are out the window.
Billy,
I can’t thank you and Chuck enough for shedding some much needed light on this situation. I’m not quite sure why more folks aren’t upset by all this. Maybe they are and we don’t hear them, or perhaps they simply don’t know.
I’ll keep my eyes peeled for your LL post – reference it here – and then link back to you.
Thanks again, Billy.
Let’s thank the residents of Sundance Ranch Estates in Winter Haven, FL for foreiting their lives & homes for these “so-called” job opportunies that everyone hopes to get when WE all know promises from CSX, city of Winter Haven & whomever is backing this project…..etc!